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ckurz7000
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 538,
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+x1) any obstacle high enough to be a conflict at 500' will be in SD. I forget the specific max height for marking an obstacle on a chart, but it's well below 500'. Even so, a 'more vigilant look' doesn't men you can't still glance at instruments. 2 and 4) These two points contradict themselves - You say SD already provides height, but then say GPS altitude is inaccurate. I agree with 4 but disagree that knowing elevation is not useful as you can then crosscheck against the theoretically more accurate pressure altimeter. 3) Excursions aren't always noticeable if they're gradual, and not everybody is as good at visually picking out heights. Also, the 500' height isn't the only usecase - Another is flying IMC due to unforeseen weather and trying to maintain an MSA of 1000' under low class A airspace (e.g. the Sevenoaks area), in which case you won't be able to see such excursions. 1) Not all the obstacles are on the chart (they get erected between issue dates and sometimes not even reported). And most people don't read the corresponding NOTAM and mark them on their charts. 2) Yes, SD does provide height and therefore gives me what I need when I want to check my AGL. And yes, it is inaccurate and fraught with GPS and elevation model errors. I care MUCH more about altitude AGL than the actual elevation of a specific point. The only time I do care about elevation is during flight planning, though. 3) Flying at 500' AGL you will definitely notice an excursion by 20% in altitude just by "the size of the houses". 4) Flying IMC without a flightplan and SD as your gude for terrain clearance is a sure setup for desaster. Greetings, -- Chris.
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Tim Dawson
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 8.2K,
Visits: 9.5K
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All potential changes to SkyDemon come with a built-in resistance. That's what stops the software becoming clunky and unusable.
To overcome the built-in resistance, a good case for a new feature needs to be made by a decent number of customers. Sometimes when we give in to the pressure of a few voices on a forum and implement a niche feature, we regret it years later when it has repeatedly confused people who are on the telephone to us.
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Gax
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 41,
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1) any obstacle high enough to be a conflict at 500' will be in SD. I forget the specific max height for marking an obstacle on a chart, but it's well below 500'. Even so, a 'more vigilant look' doesn't men you can't still glance at instruments.
2 and 4) These two points contradict themselves - You say SD already provides height, but then say GPS altitude is inaccurate. I agree with 4 but disagree that knowing elevation is not useful as you can then crosscheck against the theoretically more accurate pressure altimeter.
3) Excursions aren't always noticeable if they're gradual, and not everybody is as good at visually picking out heights. Also, the 500' height isn't the only usecase - Another is flying IMC due to unforeseen weather and trying to maintain an MSA of 1000' under low class A airspace (e.g. the Sevenoaks area), in which case you won't be able to see such excursions.
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ckurz7000
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 538,
Visits: 2.2K
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+xWhy would you stop glancing at your flight instruments at 500'??? How would you even know you're at 500' unless you've looked at an instrument? Not everybody just flies A-to-B at 3000'+, and those of us who do fly at heights under 1000' are completely capable of glancing down for 1 second to read the panel without suddenly rocketing into the ground at 1500'/min (which would still require 20 seconds of descent) BTW, I also fly a gyro and I regularly fly on the lower end of the spectrum. The reason I question the usefulness of knowing elevation figures are these: 1) At low altitudes there are increasingly more obstacles. They are sometimes not on SD, and therefore I keep a more vigilant look out when flying low. 2) Glancing at the altimeter is fine but what I am interested, really, is not dropping below the minimum allowed altitude. Knowing elevation is not going to help me doing this. Altitude above ground level will, however. And this is already provided by SD. 3) Flying at 500 feet, I can easily detect altitude excursions because 100 feet is 20% of my altitude. Whereas at 5000 feet it is only 2%. 4) Altitudes from GPS and a digital elevation model are notoriously inaccurate. Greetings, -- Chris.
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Gax
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 41,
Visits: 0
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Why would you stop glancing at your flight instruments at 500'??? How would you even know you're at 500' unless you've looked at an instrument? Not everybody just flies A-to-B at 3000'+, and those of us who do fly at heights under 1000' are completely capable of glancing down for 1 second to read the panel without suddenly rocketing into the ground at 1500'/min (which would still require 20 seconds of descent)
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guille
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 149,
Visits: 2.4K
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+xAre you saying you look at your altimeter when flying 500 ft AGL? I am looking outside all the time at that altitude. No altimeter required and hence no elevation information. -- Chris. Sorry, but flying slowly with a Gyro, you can look at the altimeter and the tablet... and of course look outside. But I always fly (since already many years) between 500 and 1000 feet AGL. And at 500 ft you can easily move to 700 ft or 300 ft without realizing it if not looking at the altimeter...
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ckurz7000
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 538,
Visits: 2.2K
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Are you saying you look at your altimeter when flying 500 ft AGL? I am looking outside all the time at that altitude. No altimeter required and hence no elevation information.
-- Chris.
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T67M
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 206,
Visits: 3.2K
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+x+xIt would be a step in the right direction, but why is there so much resistance to making an existing instrument which toggles Alt/Hgt into a three-way Alt/Hgt/Elev instrument? The data obviously exists within the application, and since I suspect most users never move away from Alt anyway, the only people who will be affected are those who might want to use the extra information, with no need for extra config options or menu items to confuse people. The principal issue is when you fly at low altitude: example, there are many military corridors between 800 ft and 5 or 6000 feet. I can fly then between 500ft and 800ft. A lot of precision is then necessary. Even with a WAAS-EGNOSS device, it would be useful to know the elevation while flying. I know! I'm agreeing with you! I want to know why the is so much resistance to making a change to SkyDemon that a number of customers seem to think would be useful!
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guille
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 149,
Visits: 2.4K
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+xIt would be a step in the right direction, but why is there so much resistance to making an existing instrument which toggles Alt/Hgt into a three-way Alt/Hgt/Elev instrument? The data obviously exists within the application, and since I suspect most users never move away from Alt anyway, the only people who will be affected are those who might want to use the extra information, with no need for extra config options or menu items to confuse people. The principal issue is when you fly at low altitude: example, there are many military corridors between 800 ft and 5 or 6000 feet. I can fly then between 500ft and 800ft. A lot of precision is then necessary. Even with a WAAS-EGNOSS device, it would be useful to know the elevation while flying.
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T67M
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Group: Forum Members
Posts: 206,
Visits: 3.2K
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It would be a step in the right direction, but why is there so much resistance to making an existing instrument which toggles Alt/Hgt into a three-way Alt/Hgt/Elev instrument? The data obviously exists within the application, and since I suspect most users never move away from Alt anyway, the only people who will be affected are those who might want to use the extra information, with no need for extra config options or menu items to confuse people.
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